You've, I just have to ask because you mentioned, your mom is from France, you've traveled for this documentary and you traveled in general throughout the world in Russia, Ukraine, what are the defining characteristics of these cultures? Let's go with Russia. So I you know, as as I told you, I came from, I'm happy Korean have Russian. I came from that part of the world. What are some interesting beautiful aspects of the culture of Russia and Ukraine? I can't

really speak. Honestly, if you're creating, I was there only in 1983 and when I visited the Soviet Union under the communism and I kept was beautiful. It was one of the nicer places I went, but they were very much stultified by the communist system. They all were the best places to visit in. Russia are always in the South for whether Georgia or, or Year the Muslim countries. There's always a better culture in terms of comfort. But communism was rough and that was the end of it, pretty much Brezhnev regime and then on drop-off and Gorbachev was in three years in the future when I was there. So I can't talk about Ukraine with and they've they're not been friendly to me since Isis, of course, since I made their Putin interviews, you know, Ukraine has banned me. I believed they they've been very tough on people who are critical. I Seen the Russian people have been very special to me and I'm perhaps because of my European upbringing, but I enjoy talking to them. I find them very open very generous and they appreciate support. They appreciate people who say, you know, I understand why your government is doing this or this. Or this is I've tried to stay open-minded and listen to both sides. The thing that I have seen as an American is, of course this American enmity towards Russia from the very beginning. I grew up in 1940. 46. I was born in the 50s. It was, it was so anti-russian. They were everywhere. They were in our schools. They were in our state department. They were spying on us. They were stealing the country from us. That was the way the American right wing. Not even the right wing. I'd say the Republican Party pictured. The Russians. They were actively

engaged in infiltrating America and changing our thinking.

And I tell The vision shows were based on this. It was very much the J Edgar Hoover mentality. That communism was even behind the student protests of the 1960s that this was the direction in which the FBI and the CIA were thinking.

So

I grew up with with a Prejudice and it took me many years. My father was a Republican and he was a stockbroker and he was a very intelligent man, but even he because he was a World War Two Soldier. He was a colonel had fallen under the Influenced you. It had in order to be successful in American Business in the 1950s. You had to have a very strong anti anti Soviet line, very strong. You wouldn't get ahead. If you express any kind of, let's end this cold war, any kind of activity of that nature. You'd be cast aside as a as a Pinko or somebody who was not completely on the board with the American way of doing business, which was capitalism. Works communism doesn't And

in particular communism is embodied by the Soviet Union as the enemy. So hence hands.

That's the way you were

the narrative behind the Cold War. That's correct. And

if they'd laid basically lasted, I mean you saw the ups and downs of it. When Reagan came in. I was well, first of all, we had the crisis of, at 1962 with a Cuban Missile Crisis and Kennedy proved himself to be Warrior for peace, he resolved that with Khrushchev. That was a big moment. Huge moment. And people don't give him credit enough for for really saving us from a war that could have could have affected all of mankind but

it still didn't avert. No

because the moment he was killed. Honestly there was a lot of we can talk about that and use you know, I've made a film for JFK Revisited is a documentary. We released this year about the G.i. Made in 1991, but the moment he was killed, I would argue that, Lyndon Johnson went back immediately to the old way of thinking, the old way of doing business, which was the Eisenhower Truman way since we, which we, which we had adapted since World War Two. That was an interim. You have to think about it from Roosevelt dies in 45. Roosevelt has an interim of 16, 15 years, where he,

he

has a, he has more of a democratic regime. More liberal. He establishes. He recognizes the Soviet Union for the first time since the Revolution and he actually has a relationship with them. He sends embassadors who are friendly and he wants, he has a relationship with Stalin Etc and Yalta and night are on rather. That's where he had the relationship. You

think of JFK lived. We would not have a cold war. No,

absolutely not. I and we go into great depth on that in the filming. I do. Urge you to see it because it goes into all the issues around the world. Kennedy was being very much, an Anti-Imperialist. It turns out and many people would just don't understand that. But you have to look at all his policies and Middle East with NASA ever had a relationship. It was sukarno and Indonesia with Latin America. You made a big effort with the alliance for progress and when Africa above all with lumumba, he was very shocked at his death and trying to do defend. The right, the Integrity of the Belgian Congo with dag. Hammarskjold of the UN, he made a big effort. Unfortunately. It didn't work out because they were dying, hammers, all was killed and then Kennedy was killed and Congo descended into the chaos of Joseph mbutu's dictatorship, but Kennedy was very active in terms of as a Irishman. Not as an Englishman. He was an Irishman. I say that because, well, we'll come back to that because mr. Joe Biden isn't Irishman, but it's a different kind of an Irishman. They're both. 'The Catholic Irish, but Kennedy really made an effort

to change

the imperialist mindset, that is still was very strong in America, and Europe, Lyndon

Johnson changed back

to the old policy and we were never able to really keep big taunt going with the Russians, briefly had it with Carter, but then zip Brzezinski came in Brzezinski was his National Security advisor. He was put there by Rockefeller and Brzezinski was a pole. He got revenge from the Poland. Poland has always been attacking Russia as far as I remember. Back to another Century. I mean, the two world wars, that occupied Russian. So tragically entry points were always through Poland and Ukraine. So

Brzezinski

got his revenge and Carter ended up being an enemy of the Soviet Union and

creating

yet as Brzezinski took pride in a he created the atmosphere. Fear of the trap, for the Soviets to go into Afghanistan. In 79. That trap was set. He says he said in 1978, so that there was never, except for brief moments of periods of Daytona with the Soviets and I grew up under that. I didn't really know anything of this going on, because I was, I was learning. I was educating myself as I was going, learning movies and trying to try to be a dramatist and this and that. So I wasn't About this. Then when Reagan came in, I was worried again because it was, it was a beat of the old beat, which was there the most evil empire. I mean, it does it goes on in American history. It doesn't end Reagan. Got a lot of points for that. And, of course, when the, when Gorbachev came in that was a beautiful moment for the world. It was a great surprise. It was probably the best years of her America from, at least, from my point of view, in terms of this relaxation in the mood. 1986 to 1991 were great years in terms of ability to believe. Once again, that there could be a peace dividend, but the world changed again in 1991 92. There's an internal mechanism, who knows? You could blame. You can blame the United States. You could blame Russia for Gorbachev was perhaps not the right man to try to administer that country at that point. He had great Visions. He was a man of peace. But it was very difficult to hold together. Such a huge Empire.

So vision is not enough to hold together. The Soviet Union. I think the

details are interesting. I've followed up on that a little bit because I was recently in poor countries like Kazakhstan talked about the the the negotiations are going on and the breakup of the Soviet Union. It's very interesting story because it involves everything Ukraine, of course, everything is going on. Now. Somewhat, is it 30 million Russians were left? Outside of the Soviet Union, when it collapsed, they had no home anymore. They were homes in other countries such as in Ukraine. So it's an interesting story and with repercussions today because extent is it / is a good example of keeping a balance, keep it in neutral. Yeah, he played both sides and he because Yeltsin wanted him to join the the Russian Confederation in a certain way. He'd be supporting a against Gorbachev. There's a hole in Word Battle error. I think the the Ukraine came along with Yeltsin as well as you'd have. I'm sorry. I don't remember now, but to other to other regions came with him and that was a block that broke up the the Soviet Union, who was yeltsin's plan to and it wasn't make the Russian Federation and they did, I would

To return back to JFK, eventually because he's such a fascinating figure in the history of human civilization. But let me ask you fast forward in. 2000. Yeltsin was no longer president and Vladimir Putin became president. You did a series of interviews with Vladimir Putin. As you mentioned, over a period of two years from 2015 to 2017. Let's let me ask who the high-level question, what? Your goal with that conversation. Oh, came

out in 2017. I guess I started them in 2014. At that point, the Snowden Affair had happened. I was working on a movie on Snowden that happened in 13. Ukraine happened in 14. And

one

thing after another by 14, Pope Putin was enemy number again becoming, and wanted man on the American list. He was enemy, he was certainly in the top five or and but the the animosity towards Putin had been growing since 2007 at Munich. I remember that speech when he made it, it's in my documentary. That's a four-hour documentary for different conversations. I mean, we talked to over two years, two and a half years, but I A that image of him at Munich making a very important speech about world Harmony about the balance necessary in the world. And I remember the sneer, the sneer on John, McCain's face. She was in Munich, obviously eyeballing, Putin and hating him. And it was so evident that McCain had no belief whatsoever that the that this he was almost treating them like this, or the Communists are back and we know that Putin was not a communist. We know that Putin is very much a market, man. And he made, no, he made it very clear and tried to keep an open climate, a new relationship with Europe. But the United States, always certain people in the United States. Always sell that as a threat. Like, Putin is trying to take Europe away from us as if we own it as if we have the right to own it, but Putin was making, the point is very important about sovereignty and sovereignty

for a

countries is crucial to for this new world to have balance that sovereignty for China's sovereignty for Russia. Sovereignty for Iran sovereignty, for Venezuela sovereignty for Cuba. This is an idea that's crucial to the new world. And I think the United States has never accepted that

sovereignty,

is not an idea that they kind of allow. They you have to be 0. Obedient to the United States idea of so-called democracy and freedom, but it's much more important is sovereignty for these countries. And the United States is not a bad that is not a as not even acknowledged it. And it never comes up. So

from their perspective, United States, one power centers arise in the world. Yes, you start to oppose those big. Be good. Not because of the ideas, but because they have But

merely because they have power. Isn't that at the heart of the doctrine of the neoconservatives in the nuke? The pack for The New American Century, they wrote down in, nineteen. Ninety, six seven. They said there shall be no emergence of arrival power. It was very clear was about power and they have and they've stuck to that Doctrine. Which is if you, if you start to get dangerous in any way or have power, we're going to knock you out

now

that won't work, but I don't believe it can work. Work. And that is unfortunately a policy of the United States is following and the neoconservatives Group, which is very

small, but it's

very strong up early. And their idea has resonated. It was it was behind the George, Bush's invasion of Iraq. It was part of not only Iraq, but cleaning out the whole world draining the swamp going to Afghanistan first. And then although Iraq had nothing to do with Al qaeda's attack going after your rocket. and, of course, 60 some other countries that were terrorism had some had some signs of There were wherever America judged would be a dangerous country. We had the right here either with us or against us.

Now that is a disastrous policy

and led to one thing after another of the Iraq war war. Never learned a lesson. The neoconservatives were never fired, never thrown out of office. The people who prosecuted that war are still around, many of them are still around and they're they're obviously guiding America. Now, let me return to this question of power.

Don't forget. The

sneer that I saw there that emblem Ides the United States reaction. Also, there were several other American Representatives who were laughing, kind of mocking Putin. It was very serious. I felt, I was a divide there. So

in since then, I mean, in a certain sense, the Europe reaction

to Boone is crucial and

they were, they were more with him back then. And a big thing

for America was always too. Keep NATO to keep Europe into in its pocket as a satellite. And with this recent war, of course, they've succeeded in all beyond their dreams of the Russians have fulfilled, the fantasy of the United States to finally be this aggressor that they have pictured for years. Yeah, we can talk about that later.

But at that time, there was Europe, had significant support for Putin. Yeah, United States was sneering and Putin was that you can say that. And then, So there's this it was there was uncertainty as to the direction as to the future of Russia. And that's exactly when you interviewed Vladimir Putin. I wanted to know what

they thought because we couldn't get the the the in the information war that the United States was fighting against Russia was in evidence background. It was full out the the condemnation of Russia on all fronts. I never Ever saw a positive article about Putin. And although it when I traveled in the world and I travel a lot doing documentaries. It was very clear in the Middle East in Africa. In other in Asia. There was respect for him that he was a man who was getting job his job done. In the interest of Russia. He was as I said on the documentary our son of Russia very much. So in a in the positive sense, a son, a son of Russian not that he's out there. Trying to destroy the interests of other of other countries, know that he was out there to sell the promote the interests of Russia, but at the same time, keep a balance. Keep it, keep it keep the world into a Harmony. This is always been his picture piece was always his idea in hours. He always referred to United States in all these interviews as our partners. And I said, will you stop using that word? They're not while

and he was a little bit slow and waking up to

What the United States was doing? Well? That

said, he's one of the most powerful men in the world. He was at that time, and let me ask you the human question as the old adage goes power corrupts and absolute power corrupts. Absolutely. Did you see? Any corroding effects of power on the man, forget the political leader. Unjust, the human being that carries that power on his shoulders for so many years. Keep in mind that he's been on, unlike

most modern leaders. He's been in office off and on, because of, there was a Medvedev was president, and he was not literally in charge. He was, he was, he was he took another appointment at that point and he but he was still very much involved, but for Many years more or less, he's been at the administrator of the state, the protector of the state and he's apparently done a good enough job that the Russian people have kept them there because contrary to what many people think, I really believe that if the Russian people didn't want him. He would be out. I firmly believe that. I don't think you can let you can go against the will of the people. Now, it expresses itself in many ways at The Ballot Box and so forth, but also in other ways in Russia, there's a strong Strong, currents of opinion. So, contrary to what the position of him as a dictator, he wouldn't last if he was unpopular. Number one. Number two, Russia is much more divided than people know there's other factors in Russia. He is, there's they're always tensions in around, the Kremlin who has power, who doesn't have power that's been going on for a hundred years, but the factions in Russia are very much there. So, when people refer to Russia, As Putin, they're mistaken. When and they do this regularly in the New York papers and all this they say Putin. Did this Putin? Did that Putin's doing that? But it's Russia, that's doing it. And that's what there's a distinction there that I it's changed in the old days. I would read about Khrushchev, but it was never Khrushchev personally. It was about the Soviet Union. There was respect

for a country. And now,

when I started to get personal with Putin, it changed and the are thinking changed in a negative way. We, we no longer respected as a country were seen as a man. And the man, we had trashed, repeatedly repeatedly as a poisoners a murderer and none of which has ever been proven, but which is always been repeated and repeated to the point at which it becomes like, an or well Mantra. It becomes like, he is, of course, the bad. I can I just ask you as a great

filmmaker as a human being, what was the like talking to one of the most powerful men in the world for

honestly? And I'm not naive, I've talked to a lot of powerful people in the movie business. There are powerful people and many of them are corrupted. I've talked to many people in my life. I've been in the military and I've seen, I've had other jobs. I have to say, I found him to be a human being, just found them to be reasonable. Be calm. I never saw him lose his temper. And I mean, you have to understand that most people in the most people in the western way of doing business, get emotional. I don't see that. I saw him as a balanced man as a man who had studied this like you had there's a calmness to you that it comes from studying the world and having a rational response to it. His, it's interesting his two daughters. One of them is very scientific and the other ones doing very well in another profession. But they are thinking there are thinking family. His wife to was I can't talk for the new wife because I don't know about it. But he's he kept his family with great respect. He's raised his daughters, right? He served Yeltsin the way he looked out and he served Yeltsin well, and he said he never trashed. Well Jansen, certainly a lot of people did but you know, I asked him repeatedly, you know, was he an alcoholic this or that, but he wouldn't even go that far just respect and This man, you know, it's and it was in it was in many ways, a ridiculed. But in by the Russians and he turned over the power because he felt like he was overwhelmed. He turned over the power to this man, because why, how many people are the fired before him? Several several prime minister's, is that why did he turn power over to Elsa to mr. Putin? Because he respected him for his work ethic and his balance his maturity. And that's what I can say is, I saw it. Poor person poor from a poor family, who worked his way up through the KGB of Americans. Keep saying he's a KGB agent but it's like saying, you know, George Bush was a CIA agent, but you know, he became a print you grow, you grow in your life and he went from this KGB to this technocratic position here at he dealt with many problems, including the chechnyan war, which is a very difficult situation, as well as the Russian. Marine probably several things happened. Early in his that balance that gave him a lot of experience and he handled them all pretty. Well,

do you think he was an honest man? I

do now, of course, the question of money. I've the charges that he's the richest man in the world are ludicrous. Certainly doesn't live like it or act like it. If you're rich, i-i've had been around a lot of rich people in my life. You'd probably have to in America, you run into them. So many of them are arrogant. I'm actually good friends now with the richest. In the world. Oval course, I saw your interview with mr. Musk, cool. I appreciate at least he speaks freely. I am, I'm positive about him owning Twitter because Twitter is become censorship. City has has all the major Tech. The censorship that we are now seeing in the United States and so on American and shocking to me, and

he is a resistance to that. That is, yeah. I like that. I like

musk for that. Just for that only, but I also appreciate him. His Adventuresome his nature and his desire to explore the world and to ask questions. Yeah, there's certain ways.

You sound when you speak freely. There's certain ways. You sound a man sounds when he speaks freely. Yeah, he speaks freely, and it's refreshing. No, no

matter whether you're rich

or not. It doesn't matter when you speak freely. It's a beautiful actually, a musket

and a major point on nuclear going back to nuclear energy. You know, he was He never believed in it at first. Apparently he was going for Batteries, right? And he didn't put a lot of money into batteries. He made them bigger and bigger batteries, but it just won't as Bill Gates has said. It's just, it's not going to get us there. Yeah, and now I think mascius on another path. He understands the need for nuclear. Yeah.

He's a supporter of nuclear. We're jumping around who

never asked for one thing. Never he was an interview. It was freeform. Ask anything. You want. No, no. Directions, no rules. As with Castro, frankly Castro did the same thing as their Chavez. So I've had good luck in interviewing free-ranging subjects. People willing to express themselves. He's much more guarded than Castro or Chavez because as you know, he he said in government policy, when he speaks and anything he says is can be taken out of context,

but there was no restrictions on what to talk of not, none of that

or any desire to see anything before we published it. No need to Ticket with them. It was a completely. Do

you think he watched the final product? Yes,

I do. But I don't think he made judgments on and I think he was pleased. I'm he doesn't go either way. You see it. It's he's pleased. I mean went well and he's happy for us and I don't think he had great enthusiasm. Expressed it to me. He trusted me and you can see the way he dealt with me. Each time. He warmed up to me, four times. You know, the first time I might have been a little All stiff. You're asking a you don't know what who you're dealing with and so forth. I understand that but he's used to it. Now. He's done a lot of press the worst press he's done. Frankly has been the American Press and not because of his fault, but because of the way they have treated him. If you look at the interviews, they're awful. They put. First of all, I noticed one thing as a filmmaker right away. They use a double and overdub. They put a Russian speaker. Yeah. For everything you said who is much harsher? He speaks Russian and much harsher manner than actually Putin does. Yeah. Who's very if you on my interview I left him in his original language with translator and I think that's important because he expresses himself very clearly and calmly. They're there. When you listen to the American broadcast. It's a belligerent person who looks like he's about to bang his shoe on the table. And the, secondly, the questions are highly aggressive from the beginning. There's no, there's no sense of Rapport. There's no sense of well. It's why? Mr. Boone, did you poison? This version? Why? Mr. Boone, did you kill this person? Why are you a murderer and immediately?

It's blunt blunt

- television. Yeah, it's not just aggressive. So

I obviously speak Russian. So I get to appreciate both the original and the translation and it's not just aggressive. It's very shallow. They're not looking to understand. To me aggression is okay, if that's the way you want to approach it, but it should be Should be underlying kind of empathy for another human being in order to be able to understand. And and so

the the some of the worst interviews I've ever listened to is by American Press Vladimir Putin.

So NBC and all those kinds of organizations. It's very painful to watch and

you saw the reception to the Putin interviews in America was hostile without seeing it. So many people criticize my Series without having seen Seen it even. Even I want on a show, a television show where this famous Colbert, you know, he's very famous American and I was shocked on the show to find out that he hadn't seen anything of the four hours. He was just attacking Putin. And through me, I was complicit. Therefore. I was a I was Putin supporter and he assured the show was a disaster. It's one of my worst television shows. I'll actually I had to just shut up and get off the air. I mean, it's some point Who's embarrassed Machine because the audience to was clapping for go beyond anything. He said

well as an interviewer in that situation because between you and Vladimir Putin North camaraderie, there was joking. There were. Are you worried?

Do you put

that into the calculation when you're making a film with somebody that could be lying to you? That could be evil that we talked about. Castro you talk about there. So, are you worried about how Charisma of a, man across the table from? You can do

exactly that into account. I absolutely take that into account. I know. Can I mean doing Castro's? He's a wonderful speaker is charismatic. So as Chavez think it is. Look at those reviews. I took it into account but Putin isn't play that game. He doesn't charm you. He doesn't try to overwhelm you with his Bona me at all. He just said, okay, ask your question. I'll give you my answer straight. Here it is. This any analyzes it? This is the history of NATO. This is a history of our relationship with the United States. How many times have we tried to talk to them about such and such and such and such an each time we get nowhere. In fact, it's a very, I would like to get along with United States so much. He saying it, he saying it so clearly in all his words. So, to play Devil's Advocate, but he's not making. Making a big deal about it. But there is a Charisma

and the calmness. Yes, there is. So like, let's just calm everything down. It's simple facts that you can. Yes, you can, you can call. So there's like the Hitler thing which is screaming being very loud, charismatic, strong message and so on and then there's a Putin style. I'm not comparing those two. There's the police without communication of calmness and and that at least, to me, my personality, that can be very can. The wedding is bringing everything down, the facts are simple, but then when you say the facts are simple, you can now start lying and you don't know what's true. And what's lost

it. Behooves you to do some research. Yes. And frankly, when it comes to research, you're going to have a problem. Because if you go to the Americanized versions of Russian history, you're going to run into a problem in that includes even Wikipedia, they will tell you things that are just not factually supported. So, it was a problem in terms. Terms of, if you read all the books in the American, the library about Putin, there's nothing positive about it. They awful, they're awful and a lot of them. I had a good relationship with Professor. Steven Cohen, who's the most I think one of the most informed men on Russia, he done a lot of research all his life and new Gorbachev very well and was very and analytical about all these situations that happened before his death in 20. 19, I'm not quite sure when Stephen Dodd, but I knew him. Well, and he was the, he gave me the best information I could get, I would go to Steven and I'd say, I'm confused here, tell me the history of this accusation of poisoning against this person and so forth. And he'd explain it to me. And I think very the clearest ways that I understood. And he said to me, once he said, most of these people who go to Russia and write this stuff about who are going off internet. The internet has really been a source of a lot of pictured facts here. He said, pure analysis. You have to go back to the text all the documents and to really fully understand but he under he want he spoke Russian and his wife and him Katerina. Katharina, Von Who-ville, who's the editor publisher of the nation magazine would go to Russia several times a year and talk to their friend Gorbachev and garbage shops. An interesting character. I talked Mm interview them, not interview them, but talk to him at length and I like him very much. And I saw that divide, as you saw in the Putin interviews between Gorbachev and Putin early on in the interviews. You sense, Putin doesn't particularly care for well cover chopped, because he and his point of view. He screwed up the administration of Russia and is responsible for so much of the disaster of leaving all those people outside the Soviet Union. So these are problems that continue into the future but

He

at the they see each other at the or he sees he knows he's there at the May Day Parade II. We filmed and he is, is he?

His

attitude is funny. It's very human. He says I you know, he's welcome. He's got his, he's got his pension. He's a pension here. He's done his duty. He's there's no, there's no animus towards it. Even when Gorbachev in the early days. You remember, criticized for his manners in terms of democracy, but Don't know that, that, you know, that becomes a coral but frankly by the, by the end of the situation. It's very clear that Gorbachev is now moved closer and closer to the says, Russia is now really under attack. This is he sees he sees where the United States has made a concerted effort to undermine Putin and he does. And he's repeated this several times about Ukraine. I think you've seen what he said. You can quote it. And Gorbachev, is we have no respect for Gorbachev. Even even at this juncture at one. Can you see Gorbachev's ideas printed in most American newspapers? Very rarely, very rarely, and not n recently, not at all. So Gorbachev, who was our hero back in in the American hero back in the 1980s 80s, has now been condemned to the garbage can so to speak of History.